dougnoll’s posthaven

Segment 1: 17,000 Nuclear Weapons.  On this edition of The Doug Noll Show we are speaking with Alice Slater, the New York Director of the Nuclear Age Peace Foundation and a member of the Global Council of Abolition 2000. Alice is also the Secretary for Sustainability of the Green Shadow Cabinet and is on the Steering Committee of the World Beyond War Coalition.

Alice was originally a New York school teacher. In 1968 she was watching TV and saw a program about Vietnam becoming a communist country, and on that same night the students at Columbia University were rioting in protest of the war, which terrified her. The very next day she went down to the Democratic Club and joined, and within a month she was the co-chair of Eugene McCarthy’s campaign on Long Island. Once her youngest child went to college she attended to law school and eventually wound up getting involved in the Nuclear Age Peace Foundation. She’s now a United Nations representative working to ban nuclear weapons.

Alice tells us there are 17,000 nuclear weapons on the planet, and 16,000 of them are in U.S. and Russia. A nuclear bomb is made out of the waste of a nuclear reactor. We are currently developing a whole new warhead, and we are not even being threatened. This is a huge waste of time and money. 

Segment 2: Military Industrial Complex.  Eisenhower warned us about the Military Industrial Complex. When Kennedy stopped the atmospheric testing, the testing went underground. Clinton finally stopped the underground testing (the Soviet Union halted it first) but then the industry went into the labs. 

There was a Non-Proliferation Treaty signed in 1970 between 5 nuclear weapon states: U.S., Russia, England, China and France. They promised to give up their nuclear weapons if all the other countries in the world promised not to use them. Everyone signed except India, Pakistan and Israel. The treaty was supposed to expire in 1995, but many non-governmental agencies showed up at the United Nations to lobby the governments to make good on their promise of disarmament. The treaty was renewed indefinitely and the Abolition 2000 Network was formed to draft a nuclear weapons treaty and international renewable energy agency treaty, which is in effect. 

Segment 3: Government is not Going to Save Us.  Iran wants the technology to make nuclear power. There’s been a move to control the proliferation of materials, so a number of countries want to get their hands on the technology. There is no way to handle the waste. Nuclear power is highly technical and there is only a select group of people who know how to handle it. There is no rational reason for engaging in the development of nuclear weapons. What’s in our favor is that the earth can’t take it anymore and people are becoming more aware of the issue. Government is not going to save us. Citizens need to take steps to change this themselves.

Segment 1: War is Not Inevitable.  War is not inevitable. It’s time to think about different possibilities. Alice thinks NATO should be disbanded, as she views it just as an old military alliance. We need to work locally but also look after foreign policy and make sure the policy makers stay on task. To find out more about Alice’s work, please visit www.abolition2000.org.

To listen to the entire interview: 

Segment 1

Segment 2

Segment 3

Segment 4

Segment 1: The Irrationality of Nuclear Arms

Is there any rational reason to maintain nuclear weapons? On this edition of The Doug Noll Show we speak with Dr. David Krieger, Founder and President of the Nuclear Age Peace Foundation, to discuss that question. A respected authority on foreign policy, international relations, peace and disarmament, Dr. Krieger has been at the forefront of the peace movement for 30 years. In 1982 he started his own dream organization: the Nuclear Age Peace Foundation. He was inspired to work for the abolition of nuclear weapons after visiting Hiroshima and Nagasaki and seeing the peace memorial museums --- powerful reminders of what happened in WWII. During his tenure as an International Relations professor he came to believe that the most important issue that confronts society today is the need to abolish nuclear weapons. It affects not only the people living today but future generations far into the future.

 

Dr. Krieger says when we realize nuclear weapons are maintained and strategies are developed totally on the basis of “rationality,” we come to understand that we’re betting the future of the world on the fact that we will continue to have leaders who are rational at all times, under all conditions and all circumstances. It’s a very unlikely proposition.

 

Segment 2: The Deterrence Argument

Is there any rational reason for maintaining nuclear weapons? Deterrence is not rational. Dr. Krieger argues unilaterally that we would be safer if we got rid of our Inter-Continental Ballistic Missiles. They are something to target in a time of high conflict or high stress. There are ICBMs in three states in the United States and the Senators of those three states, encouraged by industry and people who profit from those weapon sites, fight to maintain those ICMBs. Between $50 - $70 billion dollars a year are spent on the nuclear weapons industry.

 

Segment 3: Capable of Eliminating a Species

With that $70 billion dollars we could fund housing programs, provide education and Head Start programs for children, fund food programs, etc. Instead we are spending the money on preserving dinosaur-like weapons that can only be used in a manner that kills indiscriminately, violates national law, is immoral at the highest level and terribly costly.

 

If you consider the greatest threat today – terrorism – nuclear weapons have no value of deterrence. There is no “place” or “territory” to retaliate against. We need to convince countries throughout the world that we must eliminate the only weapon system in the world that is capable of eliminating us as a species.

 

Segment 4: The Non-Proliferation Treaty

The Non-Proliferation Treaty, which entered into force in 1970 and extended indefinitely in 1995, leveled the playing field to some extent. The countries who signed the treaty agreed to not acquire new nuclear weapons and to pursue disarmament, but there are still over 19,000 nuclear weapons in the world. Four countries did not sign the treaty: Isreal, India, Pakistan and North Korea. They don’t consider themselves bound by its provisions.

 

To listen to the entire interview:

  

Segment 1

Segment 2

Segment 3

Segment 4

Segment 1: “We’re going to war.”

Our guest on this edition of The Doug Noll Show is no stranger to war and espionage. Art Keller is a former CIA officer who served in the Counter-Proliferation Division, a unit responsible for spying on and sabotaging Weapons of Mass Destruction programs. He also has worked on terrorism cases and his last assignment was as acting Chief of Base in the tribal areas of Pakistan.

 

Art’s personal journey began after high school, when he joined the army and then studied foreign affairs in college. His interest in foreign affairs led him to apply to the CIA and after an arduous selection process (he applied multiple times, and later found out that was the norm) he was accepted into the CIA organization. He wound up in the Counter-Proliferation Division with instructions to keep an eye on weapons of mass destruction. It was Art’s job to cover Iran’s missile program, and he does not believe that Saddam Hussein ever had weapons of mass destruction (WMD). However, his Chief of Station returned from headquarters and announced that “the decision had already been made: we’re going to war.” It was shocking.

 

Segment 2: A Corrupted Process.

In order to make the best policies, the policy makers need to know what’s really happening in a particular area. If we shape our intelligence around our policy objective (instead of the other way around) the process will be corrupted. Art spent a few months in 2003 and 2004 near Baghdad in 140 degree weather looking for weapons in the desert. By August 2003 it was clear to him that he was just going through the motions, but he had his marching orders and dutifully followed them out. He became certain there were no WMDs to be found. No one came forward with any viable information.

 

Segment 3: The Slow and Meticulous Dance.

The negotiations have resumed with Iran and the West over Iran’s nuclear ambitions. Historically, peacemaking arms control has been a very slow and meticulous dance. There is a lot of distrust. From the viewpoint of the U.S., Iran hasn’t wanted to negotiate in good faith. Art says Iranians think very differently from us, but they do think. They have a very keenly developed sense of their own self-interest, which does not include having their whole country destroyed. A lot of it has to do with national pride. For example, they can’t believe Pakistan has a nuclear weapon and they don’t.

 

Art is greatly concerned about Israel and how they take actions without considering American interest. They have a proven record of bombing other people’s nuclear facilities (Iraq and Syria) as well as assassinating weapon scientists. It is an established pattern.

 

Segment 4: It’s Not About the Gadgets.

The CIA’s definition of assassination is killing someone - usually for political reasons - from a country with whom you are not at war. Art’s book, Hollow Strength, is about assassinations, secrets and espionage. It’s technically fiction but is based on his real life experiences. Human Intelligence is not about gadgets; it’s about relationships with people. Ask yourself this question: How bad would it have to be in your own country for you to be a spy for another country?  

 

To listen to the complete interview:

 

Segment 1

Segment 2

Segment 3

Segment 4